Episode 17
Conversations with People Who Hate Me
Episode 17 of Andy’s Podcaster Podcasting Podcast
Conversations With People Who Hate Me
INTRO MUSIC
ANDY
It’s Andy’s Podcaster Podcasting Podcast, Episode 17.
SFX- flying cockroach
ANDY
THE COCKROACHES CAN FLY! I was asked to start the show this way by my long distance hiker buddy Roderick Berger - because The Kerouac House in Florida just published an alumni update piece from me in their newsletter and those were the first words I wrote in Jack Kerouac’s house when I was resident there in Spring 2003. Shortly after having chased a cockroach across the room only to have it stop and fly back at me. Click the link in the show notes to find out more about the Kerouac house and my time there.
OK I hope the New Year has started well for you. Thanks for all the kind words about the lemon situation. I’ve been in for more tests, nothing much to report so probably leave that for next week though. We had a great holiday up in Rochester, NY with the family. We all got spoiled by Jen’s folks, the kids especially of course, we got a bit of snow, all our way through a mountain of cakes and cookies. Santa visited, brought presents, Blaise is five, so it was all about lego. Sierra wanted a puppy and put puppy down as numbers 1-5 on her gift wish list. Of course Santa didn’t bring her one and we were a bit worried but she took it well, I just told her, that Santa’s is a bit of dick. Pointed out how he purposefully perpetuates Capitalist class war by taking rich kids really expensive gifts and giving orphans and poor kids second hand wooden toys and useless castrating propaganda shit like illustrated Bibles… She took it well, really showed some maturity she’s seven and we even sort of gambled with experience gifts for her in the main, a climbing package on a ropes course rather than toys and it could have been weird since - Blaise, her younger brother is all about the toys - but it was good… We also managed to fit in one of the greatest date nights in recent memory, we saw the film Parasite at The Little Theatre which was phenomenal and then as we were walking back to the car, looking for a place to get a drink, all happy and buzzing and talking about the film and we discovered an axe throwing bar. Jen’s new play, Hot Little Slice, features some axe wielding destruction so we had to give it a go and it was surprisingly awesome. We went in, signed the massive twenty page disclaimer that somehow limits their liability on selling you 15% proof mead and handing you a bucket of heavy razor sharp throwing axes and after a little two minute safety talk and bit of instruction we were splitting wood. Total blast. They even had a wall full of viking helmets you could wear. It’s actually really satisfying downing a craft brew and screaming ‘FOR ODIN’ and then thudding in axe into a wooded target from about nine feet. I thought it would be hard but we both did really well, landing way more than we missed. And we left with all our limbs intact too. Which was a bonus and something I hadn’t thought about since my heavy drinking younger days in some of the rougher pubs of the British Isles! So to summarize - watch Parasite, Santa is a dick and if you get the chance, go throw some axes.
Music - rise of the black centipede - Mario rom’s interzone
ANDY
Its… Review… Time… Mmmmmwahahahahahahahahahahaha
AnDY
Today I’m reviewing Conversations with People Who Hate Me from Dylan Marron. I’m a big fan of Dylan’s work. He’s an actor and social activist. I first found him through Welcome to Night Vale, the superb comedy sci-fi drama podcast I reviewed a few episodes back, but he’s probably best known for creating viral youtube videos including the EVERY SINGLE WORD series where he edits of films to splice together only the words spoken by actors of color together from big movies and franchises to brilliantly highlight the shocking state of representation in Hollywood. One of the best ones is the Harry Potter supercut of all the Harry Potter movies - the full seven or eight films of twenty five or so hours… gets boiled down… wait for it… to an absolutely stunning six minutes, AND with a large proportion of that coming from a talking shrunken Rasta head dangling from the rear view mirror of a magic bus… As a White Person with eyes and conscience, you’re aware that theres a representation problem in the stories we watch and tell but this really hits home. Another video series he’s done on Youtube is great ‘Unboxing’ series where he explains and unpacks large ideas and concepts like MASCULINITY, POLICE BRUTALITY, PRIVILEGE, and LIBERAL ELITISM, as you can hear, he does it all with a joyful snarky humor that manages to be funny, cutting and yet also self-deprecating. Sooooo, we’ve had social media in our lives now for a decade or more and I’m sure I don’t have to explain what the comments section under these videos looks like… yeah, never read the comments section if you don’t want to be ashamed of humanity. Responses, to Dylan, like most comment sections, range from the bland, supportive and adoring and down to the hate filled shrieks of the rage from people who have internalized the Christian message that ‘God Hates Fags’ in either a full on Westboro way or with the equally evil - fake piety of Mike Pence et al. Or he gets abuse from folks who want to believe we live in post-racial America, that the election of Obama and the wealth of Oprah somehow means they can ignore what happened to Tamir Rice and Trayvon, Eric Garner or the Central Park 5 or that after the Republican Mayor terms of Giuliani and Bloomberg were up the NYC Police had to shell out a mind-blowing 400 million dollars in police misconduct settlements. Or he takes abuse from White Men wanting to ignore the culture of misogyny and cry out their own hurt feelings. Or he takes abuse from people who’ve internalized the propaganda of the rich in which poverty is purely down to personal failings rather than the Systematic failings of Capitalist extremism - I mean you know don’t you - that 99% of the population - even if we’re managing to pay the rent, we’re about 3 bad months away from an inescapable debt death spiral but no matter how many jobs you take on - you’re never three months from being a millionaire. So yeah, Dylan has taken an absolute dogs abuse online and in his podcast - Conversations with People Who Hate Me… he reaches out to the people who have told him go a die and all the other stuff and very bravely opens up a conversation with them, not to try and convert them on the politics but just to find a real human connection. It’s amazing and a real personal revelation. You need to subscribe and download these episodes and listen to these conversations, because I really feel like he’s mapping out a better future for our communication online. It’s so good at times that it triggered my bullshit detector at one point and I had to e-mail him to make sure it wasn’t some scripted thing and he wrote back right away and explained how these beautiful moments of introspection have come together, and he feels that most people have kindness in the hearts and we just need to talk and communicate better and calmly, remembering that there are people on the other side of the keyboards. SO the show develops a couple of key themes and catchphrase - one being that HURT PEOPLE HURT PEOPLE and the other being That Empathy is not Endorsement and this latter one was the subject of a TED talk he did, talking about this podcast and his own journey to discover this super important truth. I’ll put links to all the ted talk and the videos in the show notes so you can check them out. Empathy is not Endorsement… yeah, I’m being changed by this idea. We can empathize with our Trumpian family members without endorsing their position… So the podcast has been going for a few years now, so you’ve got a lot of great episodes to listen to and it’s format has changed a little bit with Dylan becoming more of a moderator to other people who have clashed on-line, and he brings them on the show to find common ground. Personally, as you know, I have a bit more of an edge when it comes to arguing my point of view, and I’ve been told, many times that I would probably be more successful if I toned down my tone and force of rhetoric and usually I would just direct people to read some text like - MLK’s Letter from a Birmingham Jail, and how, waiting and calmness is not an option for the refugee kids dying in cages in concentration camps on our borders, because we’d rather have a Spaceforce and a massive military occupation in Iraq than feeding, housing and educating kids escaping violence. But I’m really starting to take this on-board by listening to Dylan show. So - He does this thing, he has this little pause, exclamations, when he hears something he doesn’t agree with - it’s this… it’s a thing that at that time, I and most people would jump in to aggressively dispute the point, instead of actively listening, showing respect and de-escalating with calm disagreement and maybe a short rejoinder of information. Now I’ve decided to try and reach out in my own way to solve one the conflicts I’m involved with in the moment - with Vladislav - you remember I reviewed his podcast Scene by Scene, rather negatively and then he came back at me - so I’ve sent Vlad an apology and some really good chocolate doughnuts - Death by Chocolate doughnuts actually from err Doughnuts Delight in Rochester and I’m hoping he’ll come on the show and we can work out our differences in a Dylan Marron type way. If it comes off I’ll put it up later in the show. Anyway CONVERSATIONS WITH PEOPLE WHO HATE ME - give it a listen, it gets 5 stars and two thumbs up, a GONG of REVELATION and a Stoffle… because I think Dylan’s spirit animal is deceptively harmless HONEY BADGER that has been known to take on and castrate lions in Africa.
Music - Rise of the Black Centipede - Mario Rom’s Interzone
Sfx - radio static -
BIG BOPPER
Helloooooooo Baby…. This is the Big Bopper Here….. HAHAHAHAHAHA
SFX - Radio Static - PORCUPINE ROMANCE ISLAND
ANDY
And now it’s time to check back in with the lovelorn residents of Porcupine Romance Island…
SFX - jungle island soundscape, slow dance music in remembered heartbreak disco
TrOY
I really thought we hit it off on our date last week, yes there was a lot of foraging for grubs, and that’s not really my thing. But I really had a lot of fun. AND I thought it was mutual… But now I sae her in the disco with Jason and you say she’s doesn’t have the capacity to enjoy slow dancing… but I know what I saw.
SFX - radio static - KEROUAC-
JACK KEROUAC
The Hard Hearted Old Farmer.
ANDY
Ah JACK! Reminds me the Kerouac Writers Project is accepting admissions through March the 15, Fancy 3 months to work on a project in Jack’s old house in Florida? Link in the show notes…
SFX - Radio Static - David Bowie Clip from 1999, prediction of Internet having prodding impact on humanity.
ANDY
Wow, David Bowie there in 1999, incredible prediction… wish we had his take on Cambridge Analytica and The NATO Defense Handbook on Russian Information Warfare, and Facebook and Twitter using algorithms to funnel and chanel us into more compliant consumers - feeding the growth of the RAGE - FEAR - constant political donations conveyer belt jackpot… Who knows where it’s all going to end, feels like dark times. The Conversation podcast really has brought me a busload of hope though. Hopefully Dylan will snag a MacArthur Genius grant this year and go from strength to strength… maybe we can use him as a template for a super chill AI algorithm that can de-escalate the countries culture war in chat rooms and comment sections around the world… Anyway, I’ve got in touch with Vladislav, from the Scene by Scene podcast and he’s agreed to talk to me. He did put out another episode the other day, which was not exactly hopeful. He says the doughnuts I sent him were poisoned, yeah, you can hear that on his podcast, I’m not going to play it here. Because… well hmmm. I’m trying to move on… so here we go, I’m calling him.. now
Andy
Hi, thanks for agreeing to speak with me today.
VLAD
Sure. I’m not scared of you.
ANDY
Erm… why would you be? OK - err I feel like I want to apologize to you. I feel we’ve got off on the wrong foot. I’ve been listening to another podcast and I’ve learned that Empathy is not Endorsement and that there are people at the other end of comment sections on social media. So - I am very sorry, that when I reviewed your podcast, that I was dismissive of your work and that you think Ron Perlman is Tom Waits on Steroids. I don’t believe that but I could have handled that better and not called you a troll…
VLAD
I accept the words of your apology.
ANDY
Thank you. Now is there anything that you want to say to me?
VLAD
Yes. I cannot believe you call yourself a Tom Waits fan and do not know this. You are so stupid.
ANDY
Hmmmm. When you say that. It makes me fell very sad and attacked.
VLAD
GOOD! That is point!
ANDY
Hummmm. I’m not going to agree that Ron Perlman is Tom Waits on Steroids. I think they are two different people but I know there is no way I’m going to convert you, short of having Tom and Ron turn up at your door…
VLAD
Would prove nothing. One could be clone. Both could be clone…
ANDY
OK, what I’m trying to say is that this is just something we can just agree to disagree about?
VLAD
Sure. Like my mother always say. You can’t cure stupid.
ANDY
Hmmmph. I’m glad we had this discussion Vlad. Did your mother ever say that about you?
VLAD
Don’t bring my mother into this. I will kill you.
ANDy
Hmmmm. I’m not bringing your mother into this, you mentioned her and I’m just trying to be more aware at the moment of the fact that Hurt people Hurt People…
VLaD
Why do you keep doing that weird pause thing. Where you go HMMMM? You think you are being wise old Jedi trying to sneak past stormtrooper but you just sound like a big RETARD.
ANDY
Hmmmm. Vlad. erm. It’s not nice to call people retarded.
VLAD
HA. Of course it is. If they are being a retard. It’s why America is so fucked. Nobody can use the right words anymore. President who lies constantly is not called liar. Millionaire Pedophile dies in jail is not called murdered. Poison doughnuts sent by you to me is supposed to be Olive Branch but kills small dog and makes old lady cry…
ANDY
No! Absolutely not. They were not poisonous, they really good, top quality chocolate doughnuts…
VLAD
Then why did they kill Carlos
ANDY
Because chocolate is toxic to small dogs - everybody knows that!
VLAD
He ate Boston Creme doughnut from Dunkin’ every week…
ANDY
Well, the quality and content of chocolate on the Boston creme - look, I’m not going to debate the merits of chocolate doughnuts with you…
VLAD
Good. You bore me. You evil dog killing man. I think you should go and use the lemon squeezer I sent you to pop your fat stupid head.
ANDY
Hummmph.
VLAD
Is that the best you can do? HMMMMph?
ANDY
I’m trying very hard Vlad. Errr. Like I say, I’m sorry, I definitely sought you out when I reviewed your show. But we’ve talked. Now. I really am sorry. You said you accept my apology, do you really hate me.
VLAD
Yes. I hate you so much. When will you get the message? I hate you Andy Stupid Stupidcast I wish you had died rather than Carlos the dog. As they say… Mic Dropping!
SFX: Skype call hang up
ANDY
Wow. Dylan makes it seem a lot easier than it looks. Shit. Still, it’s all a work in progress right! I’ve got a lot to learn I think about being a reviewer and engaging with people with, different information bases than my own. But that’s Podcasting… Ups and Downs - On the Up side one of the other Tom Waits podcasts I reviewed called With Confetti In Our Hair - really liked my review - well I think so, generally, one of hosts anyway- Bill did the other host James, I get the feeling he thinks I’m a bit of weasel… anyway they got in touch and invited me on their show - so I’m making a guest appearance with them soon. Which is lovely. My first guest spot on another Podcast. Super super excited… I’ll let you know how it goes…
Music - everything is permitted - Mario rom’s interzone
ANDY
SO that’s it, it’s a wrap…. Thanks for listening.
If you enjoy the show, please subscribe, spread the word or keep me fueled and buy a coffee by hitting the link in the show notes and on the webpage…
The Jazz is brought to you by Mario Rom’s Interzone, I don’t know who’s providing your Jazz but I think you should switch to these cats!
No word from Hedge still, very sad, don’t even feel like reading the sponsor message to be honest. So I won’t.
See you later Alligator
In a while Crocodile
Mind how you go Flamingo
Wear a warm hat - Naked Mole Rat
Lets Dump Mitch McConnell in a Ditch - Ostrich…
HAHA, so much for trying to be calm and more respectful… I can see it’s going to be hard.
Have a great week, whatever you’re up to!
BYEEEEEEE.
Music - everything is permitted - Mario rom’s interzone